Is Your Workplace Psychological Safe? Four Questions to Ask Yourself

Episode 171:  Have you ever heard of Psychological Safety? Psychological safety  is when individuals are comfortable sharing their thoughts, ideas, and concerns without fearing negative consequences. It might sound like it's not a big deal, , however, it really makes a difference in the performance of your team.  Vonda and Lori share examples of what it is, why it's important and what you can do to be sure your team feels safe in the workplace. 

Sponsored by:
Flower Clique
Flower Clique Prep School
Real Life Retail Florist

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

If your designer's not respecting you, because that's hard to get back. If I've worked for someone before where there's not respect, that's really a hard one to get over, quite honestly. Welcome to the Business and Pleasure of Flowers. We're your hosts, Vonda LaFever and Lori Wilson.

SPEAKER_01 0:23

And we believe that business and fun are a perfect combination. Kind of like us, Vonda.

SPEAKER_00 0:34

So today, Lori, it looks like we're getting this podcast recording in after your workout.

SPEAKER_02 0:41

Yes, yeah. As you can tell, I have not showered yet. Work comes first.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

They can't smell you. It's okay.

SPEAKER_02 0:49

Right, exactly. So there were two things as I was driving home from the gym that I wanted to share with you and everyone listening, and it has nothing to do with flowers. It's just more feel-good, happy stuff. So, as you know, my husband and I go to this particular workout class three days a week, and it went to Fridays, and we've kind of developed relationships a little bit with some of the people because it's the same group. Um, there are some other couples, but there is this one couple. I would say they are in their late 70s. Oh wow. Every time they come, they have matching outfits, including the shoes. Like if she has bright yellow shoes with white, he's gonna have white with bright yellow swoop. Like they're and their t-shirts are always the same. She has little leggings, always brightly colored leggings, and he has shorts that are a color of something in the leg. Anyway, this is what my husband and I strive to be at some day. Right, right. Oh my god, they're just so cute, and you know, it's a pretty intense workout. You can make it your own, right? And so they're really good at modifying. And what I think is so cute, um, there's some certain things that you have to get like the certain right weights and stuff. He always assists her before he gets on his thing. I don't know. It just made me happy because they're adorable. I'm like, you know what? I can't wait to be that age with my husband someday. I used to think, oh my gosh. How are we gonna survive? But anyway, it was very cute, very inspiring. Um, the other thing has nothing to do with it. This I am showing a Trader Joe's product, as you know, my obsession with Trader Joe's, as yes, Ellie has one too. So they always have this um candy coated goodness. It's like a chicks mix but tons of chocolate in it at Christmas called Jingle Jangle. So I was at the store the other night, and they now have Springle Jangle for spring.

SPEAKER_00 3:17

Cute.

SPEAKER_02 3:18

So good. Vonda, you would eat the whole bag.

SPEAKER_00 3:22

I would eat the whole bag at one time. That will be the problem.

SPEAKER_02 3:24

Well, that's the thing. Look, like I bought it yesterday. Look what's left. It's and I brought it in, and my son and my husband were both like, why did you buy that? Because we all can't stop. Anyway, I highly recommend it. It's a seasonal product, so it's not gonna, I won't have to buy it year-round, thank goodness. But anyway, Springle Jangle, Spring Jarping. Okay, well, anyway.

SPEAKER_00 3:52

Thank you for sharing that. I'm unfortunately, I don't have a Trader Joe's close by, so that's a problem.

SPEAKER_02 4:00

I know, and I don't mean to tell you things so that you are coveting my location. Yes, I just with the rest of the world because I think it's fun. I love to find new products, especially at Trader Joe's, especially Trader Joe's, right? So, all right, what are we talking about today?

SPEAKER_00 4:18

Well, I'm gonna kind of segue into this, Lori, because I know that you're a people person, right? Without a doubt. I am so let me ask you have you ever been in a situation, conversational situation, where you felt like you didn't want to share your thoughts or or your ideas with someone, or whether it's in a group situation or in personal conversation?

SPEAKER_02 4:46

Well, first of all, that's a very good question because what I know about myself is I rarely feel, oh, I shouldn't speak up, right? Because of my personality. It's almost the opposite. She needs to shut up. So it's but I will tell you the answer is yes. There have been situations where I wasn't scared to speak up because I was worried they wouldn't like my thoughts. I just didn't care enough to share. I remember sometimes even during my teaching era, you know, when you're having um big administrative meetings and you just go to all of these things, and there were times where I'm like, I'm just looking at the clock. And I know the question they're asking. I honestly kind of do know what would be the great, the a great idea to go, but I just don't care. Um I I don't know that I have ever not spoken up for fear that people would make fun of me or think that's a bad because I maybe I'm not self-aware enough to know but you are very self-aware.

SPEAKER_00 6:01

Your self-awareness is really high. So I wondered what it was that made you have your guard up, you know?

SPEAKER_02 6:07

Yeah, if that or the personality of the person running the meeting, yeah, that's sometimes huge for me. And it's it's all about whether I'm motivated to say anything or not. Um, if they are, you know what I mean. I can't really even describe a personality type, but somebody like that, I really and honestly, I would not stay if that was a job, I would not be able to stay long, yeah, for sure. In a situation like that, because it goes against everything that I believe in, as far as giving everything you have to a job. So, what about you? Have you ever been?

SPEAKER_00 6:48

Yeah, I have, and you know, because I'm on all kinds of committee meetings and all this stuff, and and when I pinpoint it, it really is because at some time during this group or with this person, I've always like been shot down. Like you put an idea and it's like shot down, or you feel like you're attacked, right? It's like, oh no, that's not a really good idea, right? And you don't feel like you're adding any value. So I think that's when, or you feel a little bit unsafe when when you're sharing, like, oh, where's that gonna go? You know, it's not gonna stay within this group of people, it's going somewhere else. And so I guess that would be my um experiences. And what was fascinating to me, Lori, is this has a name, it's called psychological safety. So what we were experiencing were psychological unsafe situations. Isn't that fascinating?

SPEAKER_02 7:43

Yeah, yeah. So what exactly for people like me that want love a definite, what exactly is psychological safety?

SPEAKER_00 7:52

Psychological safety is when individuals are comfortable sharing their thoughts, ideas, and concerns without fearing negative consequences like rejection or ridicule. So that's the actual definition. So we can kind of put that out there for people. It's like, you know, you're you're safe in a situation, psychologically safe, when you feel like you can contribute to the group or the persons that you're speaking to.

SPEAKER_02 8:21

That's very interesting. I know you know we've had uh Nicole Price on the podcast a couple of times, and last time she was on talking about empathy, shortly thereafter, she um posted some content about psychological safety. And I was like, wow, and the one thing that stuck out for me as far as thinking about creating a psychologically safe environment for co-workers, do not um misconstrue psychological safety with kindness or enabling, or you know, those types of things, they're very, very different. Yeah, I'll just use our company for example. When I'm sitting in with you and Ellie, and we are at your house and we are brainstorming. Let's talk about when we were doing sales prep school. Let's just because that was a good we were going round and round with ideas because we're getting everything we can out on paper, and each one of us at one time shot down somebody else. It didn't hurt us because we trust each other and we know everyone in the room is for the other person, right? So it's true, you don't have to go, oh yes, if you truly don't actually you do more damage, right? Because you don't tell them, give them constructive feedback on it. So that was important for me as far as the difference. Psychological safety does not mean complete kindness and you love everything, everybody gets a ribbon, right? Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:06

Or a trophy. Or a trophy. Everybody, you get one, you get one, you get one. No, no. What's interesting though, and the reason that we're covering it today is because it really does have a lot to do with the workplace. You know, large companies such as Google have done studies on this and found that when you have psychological safety, people are more innovative, collaborative, and trusting, right? When that all is happening, they perform they perform better and their decisions are smarter. Wow. I know, right? So let's look at a few things that our clickers could ask themselves to see if they have an environment for their team that is safe or psychological safety is created within that team.

SPEAKER_02 10:54

Okay. So we have what, like four kind of off the top of our head, yeah. Um things you can mentally check off to see. And if you have all four of these, or if you have two, I mean, if you have any of them, you maybe need to uh rethink how you're you're treating your staff or whatever the culture of your shop is. So the first one is high attrition rate. Now, we talked about this last week a little bit, you and I, and it's kind of hard for a lot of shops to look at that now because we've we're you know, we're in a pandemic for two and a half, three, three years, right? And so regardless of what a great business owner you are or not, people were leaving for whatever reason. So maybe filtered those people out, like the people that had to quit because they needed to stay home and homeschool their kids because their kids couldn't go back to school, or an elderly employee that just didn't want to risk it. And so they had to quit. Those kind of people I wouldn't worry about. It's it's all of the other people that maybe stayed a little bit and left were, you know, so that is that is one chat mental note to make on how how's the how's the psychological safety in my store.

SPEAKER_00 12:18

I attended a webinar with uh Mark Murphy, and it was the no-hut tactics to create psychological safety. And you I shared it with you, you know, we kind of went through that. And what was interesting is they were talking about the employees and how safe they felt in those groups. And when they did the survey, it was really 41% felt that they weren't in a good situation, which is pretty high. Some said they that their leader never responds, some said they rarely do, occasionally, but those all came up to 41%, where only 26% said that they felt that they were in a situation that their leader always listened to their ideas or what they had to say. That's astounding because it's almost 50% of people that don't feel safe, which means that's why the attrition rate is so low, right? It's because they're leaving, they're like, they're not listening to me anyway. I don't have anything to contribute.

SPEAKER_02 13:15

I have a friend who recently left her job and she had been with this. It was it's not even in this industry in the full, but it's in the company, she was there for a very, very, very long time. And she over the last year got a new boss, and the boss was very nice, but she could never get rid of that feeling of this boss would not think twice about throwing her under the bus at any given time. She just kind of had that vibe from her. Um, and finally, that feeling, it not only made her paranoid, right? It made her not know who to trust, it made her probably not as excited and productive as you should be with a job. Um, because it was a very creative job, headspace job, you need to be super creative. Um, and so she quit.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:14

And the thing is, she kind of reminds me of Ellie in that when Ellie talks about embossed bonus when she goes to work for um a flower shop, and you know, she was born and raised in a flower shop, and she's in college once a part time, and all they let her do is maybe process just all of those stuff, things she didn't even tell them why, she just leaves, and that's exactly what this girl does did. So I'm guessing there's a large percentage of people that leave and they never tell the boss why, and it's because they don't feel that you have their back, you don't feel that you value their input.

SPEAKER_00 14:56

That's now that's number one, is super, super important. I mean, look at look at your attrition, people leaving and not telling you why, and just that's a really good point, Lori. The other one is people don't speak up in a meeting, you know. You're having a meeting, and there's always one or two who are always saying something. There's often someone who's just not speaking up, and right don't know if they had a bad experience at one of the meetings or they just don't care.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

Right, and and in those moments, this is it's in my opinion, it's so easy for a manager to run that type of meeting, and you know the people that are constantly raising their hand talking. It might be a time where you're gonna actually turn to Vonda, who never raises her hand and say, you know what, I'd really love your input there.

SPEAKER_00 15:54

So you're exactly right, Lori, when you point out and ask that person, because some of the questions that this webinar we attended with Mark Murphy was like, Hey, Lori, what would you like to do? Who else has an idea? And if they're not saying anything, then you just say, let's let's go around the room. Now, Lori, now Cammy, now Ellie, now everyone in the room, and then just you know, when things are happening, say, hey, now now that's brainstorming. I'm loving the ideas that are coming because then you're encouraging them to continue, you know.

SPEAKER_02 16:26

My little tip with that is when you're being very intentional and you want the people that don't talk to talk, and you do ask them for their feedback, make sure you know the question you're asking for feedback is something they truly can answer and feel successful because what I know when I used to teach, and you always have those same kids, you know, raising the hand, raising when we're talking about a book. Um, but I wanted to hear the the more shy ones, the more people. And so I would pose a question that I knew everyone in the room knew the answer to. Maybe it's it's just obvious because maybe we read it in class. I'm going to go to a person that doesn't speak up because I want them to feel what it feels like to be successful in answering, you know, and then I'm gonna praise them and I'm gonna maybe hopefully continue that conversation a little bit. It's just like if you're having a staff meeting. You know, you you want to whatever you're wanting feedback on, if you want those people to speak up that don't ever do it, make sure the topic is something you know they know about.

SPEAKER_00 17:43

So you could ask, we're getting flowers in three days a week. Lori, do you think we need to get those four days a week, or do you think we could cut back? Right. Because they're designing and they know the flowers that are around. So something like that that exactly.

SPEAKER_02 18:00

And if you were asking, if I was asking you that question and you say, you know, I I really do think uh four days is better. I'm gonna respond and go, me too. I'm glad that you feel that way because that's how I feel. I just needed to make sure we're all on the right track. That opens up that employee to, oh, we we thought about the same stuff, you know, and and maybe spark something. Your your goal is to spark these the ideas in these people's heads to change because you got a whole creative force right in front of you in these meetings.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

And even if one of the other employees comes back and says, No, I'm thinking maybe two days. Well, explain that. Tell me why you think two days is better, and then at least you're engaging the whole team and exactly not necessarily debating, but you're getting everybody to contribute, yeah, which is kind of the key, you know, and let them feel like it's safe for them to say whatever it is they're thinking.

SPEAKER_02 19:00

Right. Which this kind of leads to the third check mark. If you feel this is happening, it's it needs to be psychological safety needs to be on your radar a little bit more, and it is your team, the majority of them always agree with you. Like, I've decided we're going to put dandelions in a dozen in a vase of dozen roses. Everyone's like, oh yeah, that's a good idea, right? Yes, you know, no one even is hearing what you're saying, they just don't want to deal with it.

SPEAKER_00 19:35

And that tells me that I've shot them down way too many times. I've not listened to any ideas, and they're just like, let her do what they want, let her do what she wants to do.

SPEAKER_02 19:49

Because she's gonna do it anyway, yes, or she's gonna do it anyway.

SPEAKER_00 19:54

So uh yeah, that's true. That's a really good checkpoint because we don't often think about that because you sometimes, as a business owner or the leader, you're thinking, wow, that's great, my whole team's behind me, and we're not going, oh, wait a minute. Maybe there is something wrong, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 20:11

Exactly. Maybe they just don't care.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

Yeah, you know, which is terrible, right?

SPEAKER_02 20:18

Right, right. And then the last one, which again flows the third one flows into this one, is you notice productivity is declining.

SPEAKER_00 20:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:29

So how do what does that look like in a shop? Like you notice your designer maybe isn't making as many as fast as normal, or what what would you think a scenario would be um if a shop realized productivity was slowing down?

SPEAKER_00 20:47

Sometimes it has to do with the quality of their work too. I think when a designer is not really into it, you look at their designs and you're like, wow, they're a little slower and they're a little off, you know? It's like, yeah, they're trying to produce, but and sometimes you can even see it in a creative person that something's not right. And yeah, and maybe it's not psychological safety at work, but something else is distracting them, or they feel like they're not safe, or they're they're there something wrong, right? And I think as leaders, we have to key into as much as we can, or like you said, have that other person like my Lori Wilson really key into okay, something's going on here, and is it within the situation at work, or is it outside, but somehow that person is not productive for a reason. It's right.

SPEAKER_02 21:46

And like I think I said at the very beginning, um, the reason I sometimes didn't speak up, it it wasn't necessarily that I was worried to I'd be shot down, it's just I didn't care. Have respect for this person that was leading the meetings. I knew all of the crap she has done. I'm like, just let me get home. I'm done. I've taught school all day. Now we're here, it's five o'clock. I'm done.

SPEAKER_00 22:13

And that's a really hard situation if your designer's not respecting you. Because that's hard to get back. If I've worked with someone before where there's not respect, been in a meeting, not respect. And you can't get over that. That's really a hard one to get over, quite honestly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:34

So let's say three of the four boxes are checked on these, and I'm a shop owner, and I'm going, what would be how do I make this better? How do I make my shop safer psychologically?

SPEAKER_00 22:48

Well, I think it starts with the one-on-one. I think it starts with you having a one-on-one with that individual. And just try to make it feel like you do care. You're listening because you want, I think it starts one-on-one where you're really listening to that person, they're listening to you, and you you feel like starting at the one-on-one stage is where you want to start before you bring them all into a group. So that's where I would start, Lori.

SPEAKER_02 23:15

Yeah, yeah. Well, especially if they don't feel safe talking in front of the whole group. I also think, and I don't know if Mark Murphy talked about this. When I if I was having a one-on-one with them, my job in that one-on-one is to listen. Right. That conversation, once it's over, it should be 75% the employee and 25% me.

SPEAKER_00 23:43

And you don't want to cross-examine them, right? When they're talking, it's not like, well, well, why do you think that? What do you think that? I mean, that's not going to make them feel safe. They're like, ooh, I'm never going to say anything again.

SPEAKER_02 23:54

It's not. And what I've learned in my life, because I have a few friends like that, they're very literal. They don't realize how abrasive they are. Um, they're just literal people, and they don't mean to come across that way. But if you feel like you potentially might be that type of person, figure out what else you can do, or have your manager have, you know, if you're the owner or man, if one of you needs to be a little more relational, whoever's having these meetings.

SPEAKER_00 24:26

This was really funny to me. And these are phrases that say, I'm really not listening. One of them was suck it up. Life is unfair. Don't worry, you'll get over it. You think you've got problems.

SPEAKER_02 24:43

Yeah, but oh, that one's the worst. That's the worst. I hate it because then it just totally makes you think I will never share my vulnerable moments with that person ever again.

SPEAKER_00 24:55

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 24:56

Ever.

SPEAKER_00 24:57

Yeah. You know, so things that, you know, you want to listen, but then it's like, I want to, I want to be sure I understand what you're saying and then repeat things back to them. I think people feel like they're really being heard then because you are you do have to listen because you're repeating back um a phrase that they said, and you're just reiterating that so that they can think about it and know that you're really listening.

SPEAKER_02 25:22

Well, I mean, if you think about the sales training we teach, that's one of the things on the list at the very end. It is so important to use their words and give it back to them. So I want to make sure if you said you want this, this, and this. And we've decided to land on this mod magenta because it's exactly the colors you said she likes. I'm sitting there listening, going, Oh my gosh, this is gonna be great. It's no different when a boss is talking to an employee.

SPEAKER_00 25:53

Yeah. But there's hope because these things can be corrected. I think it has to start individually and then bring it into the group situation. And it can change. I think that's what everybody should know is you can create that psychological safe environment for your team and hopefully not have that attrition going on. I think the attrition one is the one that you would go, what am I doing at the very beginning? Because some employees leave right away, right? But I'm putting off vibes that are not pleasant, like your friend who left her job, right? It's like, right, what are those vibes that yeah, oh no, I don't want to work for this person.

SPEAKER_02 26:34

Yeah. Well, because she never actually had proof that her boss was throwing her under the bus, yet she knew she didn't trust her. And so that's all you if you feel that way, it doesn't matter whether you have proof or not. If your gut's telling you this person, I gotta be, I gotta watch my P's and Q's when I'm around them because blah blah blah. Um, you just be out of there, you just leave. Yeah, yeah. And then the per the boss is like, What? What have I ever done to you? Well, nothing really. I mean, that's the thing, you know, it's we have no idea that we're giving off that feeling sometimes, and we're all every one of us, including myself. I can be the most people-y person in the world, but I've had times where I've probably very much given off a vibe of she's not approachable.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

I know I have people have said it to me. We all have, you're right, because you know, like somebody was saying this week, my claws are out today, so be careful. Yes, but you know, yeah, just yeah, you just have to be careful um of how we're approaching other people.

SPEAKER_02 27:48

So right, we we have I had no idea that people thought that this particular person, I mean, it was 10 years ago, thought that I was was scared uh as far as approachability. No, that's crazy. But you know, I needed to have that conversation and it all worked out.

SPEAKER_00 28:14

So we have that checklist, those four to ask yourself. And I will just wanted to throw out one other thing is that if you're feeling like you're in a meeting situation and no one is really contributing because maybe they don't feel safe, have them write your ideas on a piece of paper and give to you. That's really a good idea, too, because then you're gonna say, you know what, especially if you have to have probably five or more people, otherwise they're gonna figure it out, right?

SPEAKER_02 28:41

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You can't do it in a comment, the old comment box where you can put anonymous things in there. Um I was thinking about all of this earlier this morning because I knew we were gonna talk about it. And one thing, at least the shop owners I have had conversations with, mostly our Flower Click members, and some off the other. I think someone in this industry, they are going to be more in tune to their employees just because they use that side of their brain more than a person that I mean, we've talked to people that just bought it as a business, they don't know anything about flowers, they've just run businesses. Like, I don't want people listening to this going, oh my gosh, I'm doing it wrong. Most of them probably aren't, but it's really good. It's good for me, it's good for you, all of us to have those little checkpoints.

SPEAKER_00 29:44

Exactly. For you just to say, okay, I want to make sure that my employees are gonna stay. Right. I think that's the key is what can I do to make sure that everybody wants to contribute? And as a business owner, I want them to contribute. The only way I'm gonna get busy, the only way I'm gonna get better is to have other people's input, and it's because it's not all about me. That saying that you're only as good as your worst employee is so true. Yeah, and so think about that as you're going through the psychological safety stuff, is like, oh man, so and so seems to be a weak employee. What can I do to bring them out more and help contribute to the growth of our business?

SPEAKER_02 30:28

And I'm assuming this is from Mark Murphy. I don't know. A leader must be open to listening and encouraging others in the organization. It is important to hire great people that are better than you. And I we talk about that in Boss's bonus, our course, Ellie and I do, because don't hire people that are exactly like you. No, no, for sure. You need all of the different personalities and all of the different gifts that each person brings in order to make it a well-rounded company.

SPEAKER_00 31:03

Don't hire people just like you, you need somebody else to round out your whole team. And if they're better than you, you're better off because that's gonna just bring it all together. So, Lori, bottom line it for me.

SPEAKER_02 31:15

I think the bottom line is when you are managing your staff, let's let's let's go back to staff meeting. Um, just for the scenario. If every time you have a meeting, even if it's a quick 10-minute meeting, right? I'm not saying you have to have long time and the same exact employees speak up that speak up every single week, and the same employees stay silent that's for every single week, you do not have psychological safety in your shop. You just don't. That would be that's the gauge.

SPEAKER_00 31:56

Yeah, yep, that's true.

SPEAKER_02 31:58

Your job is to walk around the room like you're teaching and pull information out of the people that are not talking and but give them something that you know they know the answer to.

SPEAKER_00 32:14

So just be self-aware of what's going on in your shop this week so you can see if you truly have a workplace that's psychologically safe.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

Right. And if you live by a Trader Joe's, get some springle-jangle. Thank you so much for listening to our podcast. We hope you enjoyed spending time with us because we enjoy spending time with you. If you did, make sure you hit that subscribe button or add the Business and Pleasure of Flower to your Google morning routine or your flash briefing on Alexa.

SPEAKER_00 32:48

Look forward to you next week. So please come back and join us to cover a little bit of knowledge and one small change in your mindset to take you to new levels in life and business.